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Thread: Network advice – separating modem and router.

  1. #1
    Rudolph member
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    Network advice – separating modem and router.

    Hi, thanks for looking at this. I have an issue on my home network that has been going on since August and my internet provider doesn’t seem to be able to do anything about it. It’s looking as if I’m going to have to put the Modem Router into ‘Modem only mode’ and use a separate Router. The issue is that the GUI stops working after 24 Hours and after that a factory reset is needed for it to function again, as you can imagen this is far from ideal when messing about and trying to do development.

    Supplier – Virgin media.
    Modem Router – Hitron CGNV4 (Version 2D)
    Software – 4.5.10.173-UPC
    Speed - upto 350Mbps (generaly about half that).

    I live in an old brick built house and due to poor Wi-Fi performance of previous equipment I use a Ubiquity UAP-AC-PRO as access point. This has been great and I want to keep using this as the only access point. I already have the Unifi Controller software installed so it seems sensible to go with a Ubiquity Router.

    Questions:
    I’ve been looking at the Ubiquiti EdgeMAX EdgeRouter series, is this what I need?
    Has anyone used or has knowledge of them and are they any good?
    Should I go with a different manufacturer?
    Am I correct in thinking that if I need 3 ports for my use I’ll have to purchase at least a 4 port, as an additional port will be needed to connect to the modem?
    Am I likely to have issues with multicast packets?

    Generally any advice you can offer would be great and if you could not be to technical as my knowledge doesn’t extend very far into this field.
    Thanks.
    Last edited by Barnabybear; 11-08-2018 at 05:09 AM.

  2. #2
    Old Man Winter member Ruppro's Avatar
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    The Ubiquity Edge routers are really good, I have never worked w/ one, but should be easy to use just like the rest of their products, so you should be OK getting one. Jon would be the best one to give you more technical insite as I know he has used them.

    I have worked w/ the Unifi gateway routers, that you configure w/ the controller for their APs, not sure of a price point but something else to consider.

    Your ISP won't replace the combo unit?

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  3. #3
    Santa member dirknerkle's Avatar
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    Here's a graphic I took from one of Shelby's postings about how his network(s) are set up, using the Edge-X router.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I have an Edge-x in my show as well using the Nanostation as the wireless AP, but it's a standalone network and not connected to the home or Internet. It's fast, never hiccups and I'm very pleased with its performance.
    Even though the DIGWDF Store has closed, it's still awesome! Thanks to all who have supported us through nearly 7 years of excitement!
    Parts of the store will remain open for downloading documentation, firmware and Gerber/DipTrace files: http://digwdf.com/store

  4. #4
    Frosty member mrGrumpy's Avatar
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    Maybe look at the Ubiquiti EdgeRouter X - This is what I use and was recommended by several Forum Techies.
    I do not connect to the internet, but the ER-X will do that if needed.

    Oh, best of all 1/4 the price @ MSRP $49

    (Dirk posted while I answered the a call....at lease we agree)
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  5. #5
    Santa's Helpers Jchuchla's Avatar
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    I have an Edgerouter X sitting right here on my desk. My project this morning is to get it configured to take the place of my old DD-WRT based router at home. I use these on client sites all the time, but just now getting around to upgrading the one at home. DDWRT has served me well for many years. But now I'm moving to VLANS at home and that's not something that's easy to do with DD-WRT.

    If you're comparing the two, the ER-X is a software based router. The ER-L is a hardware based router. The ER-L will have greater raw throughput for Layer-2 routing. If you're relying on Layer-3 routing, or other layer-3 software driven functions (SPI firewall, etc...) then the ER-X is going to excel. The differences between the two though are small and not likely to be noticeable.

  6. #6
    Rudolph member
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    If you already have the unify controller setup, you may want to consider the Unify Security Gateway and a Unify Switch. All the setup stuff would then be in a single place. Defining VLAN's and such is trivial (and again, in a single place). A bit more expensive, but likely easier.

    FYI: my entire network is Unify based. All switches, gateway, access points, etc... Kind of nice having everything visible in the one place.
    Daniel Kulp
    Framingham, MA

  7. #7
    Santa's Helpers Jchuchla's Avatar
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    FWIW: I did a bunch of googling before I decided on the edgerouter over the USG. The Unifi controller GUI for configuration of the USG is more limited than that of the Edgerouter. This may not matter if you don’t have those needs, but for the things I needed, there was a lot more CLI required on the USG where the ER has it in the GUI.


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  8. #8
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    Hi, thanks for the responses so far.

    @ Ruppro. Good to know, with regard to my ISP they have just changed the combo for a second time and I can login past the normal 24 hour deadline there may be hope yet.

    @ Dave. From Shelby’s picture its interesting having the options to have multiple networks I hadn’t considered that. Great to know you’ve had good results.

    @ mrGrumpy. Thanks for the recommendation.

    @ John. We run a business from home that uses a web based service so we are constantly updating that but it isn’t large amounts of data compared to the domestic side of things. My son’s gaming (nothing serious), wife watching cats on Facebook and knitting tutorials on YouTube, myself checking out videos of peoples shows and the usual family streaming of Netflix. Which to be fair to the ISP is all working fine, it’s when I get a PM about some code I posted, flash up an ESP that uses DHCP and my router’s GUI comes up as ‘not found’ so to find the IP address I have to fire up the tablet launch ‘Fing’ and do a network scan. It shouldn’t be that hard.
    Without being silly money is not an issue, the Ubiquity UAP-AC-PRO has been one of the best purchases I’ve ever made, it is mounted on the first floor celling (I think you call that the second in the US – anyway two story and it’s in the top one) in one go it fixed 10 years of hit or miss Wi-Fi signal around the house. Even if this new combo box works I feel it’s time to invest again and have control and options future ISPs may not provide.

    @ Dan. That’s an option I would consider, could you make a recommendation based on the following please so I can look further into this and the costs.

    There are three cat5 cables running from the Modem / Router:
    1. To a network switch in the loft that feeds four rooms:
    1.1. A network switch in my Son’s room:
    1.1.1. Laptop.
    1.1.2. Xbox.
    1.1.3. Printer.
    1.2. A network switch in a spare bedroom we use as my wife’s office.
    1.2.1. PC.
    1.2.2. Network printer (black and white).
    1.2.3. Network printer (colour).
    1.3. Main bedroom – unused.
    1.4. Guest bedroom – unused.

    2. To the UAP-AC-PRO, which at any time has between 20 and 30 connections.
    I’ll not list all but typically: 3x tablets, 3x phones, 2x Amazon echo, 1x network camera, 1x Pi running Node Red and at least 10x ESP8266’s doing home automation.

    3. To a Network switch in my office:
    3.1. PC.
    3.2. Laptop.
    3.3. Network printer.
    3.4. The projects I’m working on. If this involves more than about four universes I use a separate network to reduce the risk of objections from the family.

    @ John (again). I was going to say please let me know how you get on but I have just seen that you have posted in a new thread.

    My thoughts at this time given the feedback is that Ubiquity is the way to go, in my mind now is which one but I have a week or so before I place an order so any comments appreciated.

  9. #9
    Rudolph member
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    For the Unify setup, you would likely start off with the USG ($119 at Amazon) and a US-8-60W ($109). I really like the US-8-60W and have couple of them. You don't realize how handy the POE support is. Your UAP-AC-PRO would plug into one of the POE ports and you can thus ditch the POE injector. I run my BBB's/Pi's via POE for much of my testing and such (less cables to deal with). My "FPP master" is a BBB on a POE thing so if something goes wrong, I can remotely power cycle it via the POE switch. I'd thus consider a second US-8-60W for your office. The rest could leave as is.
    Daniel Kulp
    Framingham, MA

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